Better Than Wolves Forum

BTW is missing something...

There's no mechanism to take items from a container (chest, furnace output, storage minecart) and itemize them. We've got the reverse (the hopper) and we can take items and turn them into blocks, take items that are already in an inventory and shoot them out (dispenser) but there's nothing to fill that one gap.

I suggest implementing a block called an "Extractor" (or whatever name you think is appropriate) that simply takes items from a chest or other container, and then deposits them into an adjacent container. To avoid overlapping the dispenser's usefulness, the block would not shoot items out, but in fact ONLY pass them to adjacent container.

This would allow for all kinds of contraptions, including more sophisticated sorting mechanisms, item transport, etc.

It would also mean that BTW covers all of the features of the allocator, but in separate blocks instead of a "do-everything" block like the Allocator mod is.

An idea I've thought of suggesting, supported

Not going to happen. This would open up an exploit that FC is not comfortable with like this:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=333

The old way of picking up the Block Dispenser resulting in it spilling its contents has been considered an exploit and was nerfed in the previous release. Such an idea would open that back up again.

We already have a method to empty an inventory. A BD can empty a chest or minecart which will spill the items. The only thing a BD can't empty is another BD.

finite8 wrote:Not going to happen. This would open up an exploit that FC is not comfortable with like this:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=333

The old way of picking up the Block Dispenser resulting in it spilling its contents has been considered an exploit and was nerfed in the previous release. Such an idea would open that back up again.

The issue there was that it allowed crazy fast cobblestone generation, not the ability to empty inventories.

Conscript Gary wrote:

finite8 wrote:Not going to happen. This would open up an exploit that FC is not comfortable with like this:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=333

The old way of picking up the Block Dispenser resulting in it spilling its contents has been considered an exploit and was nerfed in the previous release. Such an idea would open that back up again.

The issue there was that it allowed crazy fast cobblestone generation, not the ability to empty inventories.

Yes, but such an idea would re-open up that same exploit. I mean, what are you going to do? Have it pull everything out except cobblestone? Not extract from a Block Dispenser? A method already exists to empty inventories, so why not stick with it? Adding something else that does something another block already does, but has less uses seems like a pointless addition. I dunno, maybe FC feels different... but i dont see the use for it.

Wasn't that BD thing nerfed because it was too powerfull for the Block dispenser? Meaning that maybe eventually there could be a block or mechanism that would do the same thing but would be way more expensive to build/operate? I don't know, but if the intention was to nerf fast cobble harvesting i think it didn't do much
The only thnig that changed is that you can't auto empty the BDs anymore so you have to do it yourself. Since they have an inventory of 9*64=576 i suspect it wont be too much of a hassle.
I for one would like something like that but probably it should be more complicated to set up. Think like bellow: they have to be powered periodicly mechanicly so you have to build axles, gearboxes, a turntable, ... to make it work, instead of a simple redstone signal.

To the OP, I think you basically want a modified version of the allocator included in BTW.

First, aren't you asking Flower to steal other people's ideas?

Second, why don't you just download the allocator mod?

finite8 wrote:Yes, but such an idea would re-open up that same exploit. I mean, what are you going to do? Have it pull everything out except cobblestone? Not extract from a Block Dispenser? A method already exists to empty inventories, so why not stick with it? Adding something else that does something another block already does, but has less uses seems like a pointless addition. I dunno, maybe FC feels different... but i dont see the use for it.

No actually, it wouldn't. I may be misunderstanding, but the problem was the speed with using two BDs instead of a piston, not the ability to drop it into a stream for further collection.
The speed of the extractor could also be made fairly slow.

Conscript Gary wrote:

finite8 wrote:Yes, but such an idea would re-open up that same exploit. I mean, what are you going to do? Have it pull everything out except cobblestone? Not extract from a Block Dispenser? A method already exists to empty inventories, so why not stick with it? Adding something else that does something another block already does, but has less uses seems like a pointless addition. I dunno, maybe FC feels different... but i dont see the use for it.

No actually, it wouldn't. I may be misunderstanding, but the problem was the speed with using two BDs instead of a piston, not the ability to drop it into a stream for further collection.
The speed of the extractor could also be made fairly slow.

To quote FC

FlowerChild wrote:The BD is not intended to be able to destroy blocks and dispense them in item form. I fixed another problem with this awhile back, but it looks like you managed to find a workaround.

Sorry, but I think such an idea would directly re-enable it. I guess you could have it so it dispenses items from a non-BD container, but as the BD is still capable of emptying the contents of any other container anyway, i don't see the point of an extractor / allocator.

Why not just have it not work on Block Dispensers...? I don't know about you guys, but the #1 reason I'd be interested in the proposed block is to remove items from a storage minecart without having to break the cart somehow, and to remove items from chests to transport them elsewhere, etc. As things stand, I suppose you could work around the chest issue by storing items in dispensers rather than chests, because then they can eject the items, but that's only 9 slots (presuming the hopper can do this here, haven't tried yet) to a doublechest's 54.

Generating cobblestone fast is hardly an exploit IMHO, but aside from stopping it from functioning with block dispensers, you could also add a minimum delay between intakes on the block dispenser, meaning it can only generate cobble so fast in a cobblestone generator.

mikello324 wrote:To the OP, I think you basically want a modified version of the allocator included in BTW.

First, aren't you asking Flower to steal other people's ideas?

Second, why don't you just download the allocator mod?

First, that's silly. Taking things out of a box automatically is not some amazing concept that nobody but the Allocator mod has ever thought of, and it's a natural extension of the automation possible in this mod.

Second, BTW already has the other features of the Allocator, so installing the Allocator is redundant. Also, the Allocator is quite OP for it's cost, whereas multiple blocks to cover the features separately is a bit more balanced. As well, BTW fits Minecraft really well and does more, so if I'm choosing between the two to avoid redundancy and mismatching, I'd rather choose BTW.

Not letting it work with a BD would be a decent prevention of that, yeah.
Also, imagine the possibilities if it could use filters like a hopper? Sort out a minecart full of loot at its destination.

That wouldn't be necessary, we already have the hopper for that.

I do agree that this might be one of a few items still missing in the automation process, together with a new way to transport items that doesn't require glitchy water physics.

Hello just STOP

We are in the beginning of the tech tree and you just aren't supposed to be able to do stuff fully automatic yet (wich a extractor would help a lot in) just have some patience and till that time you just need to get around with what is given to you and be happy!

Thieme wrote:Hello just STOP

THANK YOU,

I do agree that this should come up again when steve has advanced to the proper 'age'

Bookmarked to be reopened at a latter date, when Steve is a little more advanced

Thieme wrote:Hello just STOP

We are in the beginning of the tech tree and you just aren't supposed to be able to do stuff fully automatic yet (wich a extractor would help a lot in) just have some patience and till that time you just need to get around with what is given to you and be happy!

Extractors seem like the same tech level as the hopper. Your point is moot, unless you suggest we spread out automation pieces over the ages, so we reach full automation near the end of it, which I would agree on.

Even then, it's still valid to discuss this now, that's why there's a suggestion forum. This is not an outrageous idea and it hasn't been discussed in depth before AFAIK.

They seem at the same tech level but it would make stuff to easy to fast that is a bit of a point i am trying to make.

Gilberreke wrote:Extractors seem like the same tech level as the hopper. Your point is moot, unless you suggest we spread out automation pieces over the ages, so we reach full automation near the end of it, which I would agree on.

Even then, it's still valid to discuss this now, that's why there's a suggestion forum. This is not an outrageous idea and it hasn't been discussed in depth before AFAIK.

Please tell me this; is it easyer to make a funnel that can be closed (aka hopper) or a device that will pick items out of a chest and then deposit them in a different chest (or spew them out into the open and let the hoppers suck them in)

this is why there is so much discussion in this thread about it being the wrong age and all such, BUT i do firmly believe in dreaming about the future~!

EDIT: God damnit i type too slow!

Thieme wrote:They seem at the same tech level but it would make stuff to easy to fast that is a bit of a point i am trying to make.

Yeah, that's my point too. Spreading the small utility blocks out is probably good.

jamestully22 wrote:a device that will pick items out of a chest and then deposit them in a different chest (or spew them out into the open and let the hoppers suck them in)

You mean a hatch? Yeah, I agree, hatches are way out there. I long for the day we find a way in real life to open a hole in a box to let the contents spill out. What a marvelous invention that would be :p

Gilberreke wrote:You mean a hatch? Yeah, I agree, hatches are way out there. I long for the day we find a way in real life to open a hole in a box to let the contents spill out. What a marvelous invention that would be :p

IRL What Said:

GRUMBLEGRUMBLELILSMARTASSGRUMBLEGRUMBLE

Gilberreke wrote:

jamestully22 wrote:a device that will pick items out of a chest and then deposit them in a different chest (or spew them out into the open and let the hoppers suck them in)

You mean a hatch? Yeah, I agree, hatches are way out there. I long for the day we find a way in real life to open a hole in a box to let the contents spill out. What a marvelous invention that would be :p

You mean that thing you can already do by eating the block with a BD and placing a hopper->chest underneath?

@jamestully22: I'm supporting your side of the debate here, don't be grumblin'.

Stormweaver wrote:You mean that thing you can already do by eating the block with a BD and placing a hopper->chest underneath?

True True, an easy fix and a souloution that one does not have to wait for.
"Wait For" as in:
Flower sees idea
Flower likes idea
Flower rips idea apart
Flower adds idea to tech tree
Flower does other stuff
Flower gets to idea on tech tree
Flower adds idea
Flower updates mod

Stormweaver wrote:@jamestully22: I'm supporting your side of the debate here, don't be grumblin'.

Every day im Grumblin!! (think in the musical sense)

jamestully22 wrote: IRL What Said:

GRUMBLEGRUMBLELILSMARTASSGRUMBLEGRUMBLE

I'm glad you took it as a joke, I was hoping you wouldn't take it as an attack, just couldn't help myself :D

Gilberreke wrote:I'm glad you took it as a joke, I was hoping you wouldn't take it as an attack, just couldn't help myself :D

At first i took it as an attack but then i read it 2-3 more times and was all like

F*** YOU!! D:<

Glad to see that we are all on the same page now tho...