BTW: Design Philosophy

[Shengji]

Whilst true, females do make up between 40 and 50 percent on average in every survey I've seen, and that tends to hold true with my experiance. This really isn't an argument you can use for anything anymore, unless the targeted demographic is males in which case you wouldn't be trying to use it anyway. Now, if you meant "shooter games", that's different, but we're getting into genre based demographics, and would have to questions mc's as well.

No, I really just wanted to contrast my opinion on guns in minecraft with my opinion on guns in all games! I'm not convinced the demographic of minecraft players is even close to 40-60 split, though I am much more prepared to believe that 40% of people who answer surveys about minecraft are female. I was really trying to show my view on games as an extension of our childhood make-believes, and little boys pretend to shoot each other a lot. Therefore it is only natural that in our culture, that guns feature heavily in or games, given that grown up little boys account for the majority of gamers (please take "grown up little boys" as a compliment, it is meant that way). Despite my opinion of guns in games in general, I would not like to see guns in minecraft. THat was all I was trying to get across - if I was one of these people who have a massive negative reaction to games like GTA or fpshooters then it would not be much of a surprise that I held the view that I do... OK I'll shut up now - I'm sure you all get it!

[Haniale]

Love the concept of a trebuchet transport system, though! =]

Ooh. Oooooohhhh....

For it to be successful though, we'd need a good way of not dying when landing. Sounds like a lot of experimentation to make sure you land into water, ala the daring high dives of the Edwardian era.

But this gets into the realm of two different types of possible topics. One is alternate transportation - I know we had sort of shelved this idea until the question of Age of Steam/Steel had become more clear. The other, more specifically in that vein, is flight. I know several other mods are out there to give the players flight, be it just a natural ability or requiring more complex crafted machines to achieve.

Thoughts? Our next topic?

Well, waterfalls slow speed too - fling them into a wall of water, and said water would be the flow which carries them to processing(I've taken to using plain hoppers as stop points in my systems, so the player can get off there).

Off topic, but I'm currently working on a dummy project that gives players a skill set, with movement being one of the hurdles I want to allow overcome, and am toying with the idea of a modular vehicle system, so I'm all for the transport topics, but despite an obvious bias, BTW transport probably would not cover vehicles, and instead be more about services that move things in them, as a convey belt effect(water, rails, etc).

As for topics, I have an idea, but I'll wait for Triskelli to close his, or for the current one to become obviously dead over the next ~5 hours, unless someone comes up with one first.

Whilst true, females do make up between 40 and 50 percent on average in every survey I've seen, and that tends to hold true with my experiance. This really isn't an argument you can use for anything anymore, unless the targeted demographic is males in which case you wouldn't be trying to use it anyway. Now, if you meant "shooter games", that's different, but we're getting into genre based demographics, and would have to questions mc's as well.

No, I really just wanted to contrast my opinion on guns in minecraft with my opinion on guns in all games! I'm not convinced the demographic of minecraft players is even close to 40-60 split, though I am much more prepared to believe that 40% of people who answer surveys about minecraft are female. I was really trying to show my view on games as an extension of our childhood make-believes, and little boys pretend to shoot each other a lot. Therefore it is only natural that in our culture, that guns feature heavily in or games, given that grown up little boys account for the majority of gamers (please take "grown up little boys" as a compliment, it is meant that way). Despite my opinion of guns in games in general, I would not like to see guns in minecraft. THat was all I was trying to get across - if I was one of these people who have a massive negative reaction to games like GTA or fpshooters then it would not be much of a surprise that I held the view that I do... OK I'll shut up now - I'm sure you all get it!

Oh, minecraft isn't 40-60 split(assuming the split is that even of course). The "surveys" vary from actual surveys, to gender analysis from game accounts and all that sort of thing, and refers to "gamers", rather than a specific subset of genre - like, shooters are hugely male, but not so much non-violent, or at least non-pvp games(or areas of games, in the case of mmo-like ones). This is starting to get off topic, but I didn't want you to feel like I was saying "NO UR DUM" or the like, but rather offering more information to an already thought out stance. Casting +1, if you will. I will offer an idea, though, to noddle over for another time - play is an extension of instinctive behaviour(as well as being a learning tool). Hide and seek is tracking/hiding, tiggy(run away from "it") is hunting/fleeing, and most sport relates to a form of fighting, be it either natural or developed post-primitive stages. With this in mind, "what" is the gun? What does it extend, what does it provide? Is the gun even important, or is it simply an enabler for the real desired behaviour?

[Triskelli]

Ok, I think the discussion about Firearms is over. The main reason they wouldn't fit isn't a thematic reason, but because it would be fluff added to the game, a superfluous feature that only serves itself. However, if the difficulty of mobs were to increase, either by numbers, intelligence or new mobs, the addition of rifles would be more acceptable.

Would anyone else like to come forward with a new topic? I think transportation would be a good direction to go in, but I don't feel like moderating again so soon =]

[Fracture]

Since Triskelli chickened out, I'll put it forward I guess. I think I count as a vet of this thread, sort of... Regardless--

Transportation. We have a few systems currently, some formal (minecarts and boats) and others more improvised (pistons, tnt, etc). In terms of vM, BTW, and simply player-created technologies, what sorts of transportation should we be looking into? Should we focus on transporting ourselves more quickly, efficiently, and in new ways, or must we focus more heavily on conveying our goods, blocks, and precious furry (woolly, leathery, etc) companions?

Furthermore, should we try to progress that which we have already, adding functionality to the aforementioned forms of locomotion, or should we be working towards new methods entirely. If the former-- what do we need out of our systems? If the latter-- what new frontiers of movement should we explore, and why? What situations may call for new and untapped forms of transport?

One final thing I add to consider, as it's a theme that almost seems to become vM against BTW in a sense-- multi-block systems, or single-occupant devices?

-Fracture

[Haniale]

What should we transport? ALL THE THINGS! Things that are us, things that are not us, things that we use, things that we've used, things we keep, things we murder while they sleep. Transport thus far seems to be chiefly non-controlled - I'd like to see controlled conveying, be it manned vehicles, targeted way points or simply controlling the flow direction of water(which is currently always.. south?).

The how? Well this leads into multi vs single I think - both vM and BTW encourage creation, in that you don't really have a "Win" button, so much that you're given the tool with which to make a win button. Need to move something? Well, you can use water, rails, holes in the wall, carry it yourself, or more recently, pistons. BTW adds elevators, and improves on a most of the vM methods. I don't think any transport methods should be added so as things which could be harnessed to use as transport. if we assume Steam age to be next, hot air is the obvious route. Parachute added to chest = chest obeys gravity, and can be dropped down a shaft. Parachest over a steam vent = chest that floats up on air currents. Steam vent could also be used to cool food as it passes through, by heating water that goes over top, or as hurty ground for mobs to fall in - lava, without the destruction. Maybe it could be used to, slowly, dig through dirt by eroding it vertically? Make compression containers, that get heated, then released to act like tnt transport without the flash back - hurls a platform up the shaft, or something.

End result is we have a steam source with multiple uses. Those uses have improved on base methods already established, either by making them less expensive to make or fuel, or reducing the size of the contraption needed. Those that did not improve, have opened uses that can be improved later. It has also added a new dimension: vertical.

Transporting vertically, currently, is kind of a pita - even with lifts, it's not very efficient. Most of the time, it's more travel via 45 degree spirals than it is vertically. With the advent of the sky worlds, vertical transport is going to be a big thing. Based on new screenshots, we're getting huge chasms. These, in addition to current caverns, are all vertically limiting - it makes sense to seek ways around it. On top of this, new biome code makes me hopefully for proper mountains, with cliffs and all, that we may need to cross - currently, it's shift + dirt. Why can we not base jump across, and hook up a rope(and later bridge)? Then, we need to over come transportation of materials across these.

The second way I see transport needing to be improved(as a logical progression, however much I love the idea of trebuche travel), is creatures. With farming becoming more important, being able to herd is going to be important. Partly, this is an AI issue(someone needs to better them wolves), but animal bait, traps and tracking need a rework - we've cultivated crops, made mass tree murdering farms and travelled to hell and back, yet we've not found a lasso or taught dogs to stay in the fence area?

Ultimately, anything added needs to, I guess, not be transport based. A powered door could potentially used as a launch pad, creature squishier, automated shelf, or, if you're really struggling, a door. Additions can have an intended purpose, but now that we're talking transport, we're looking more at items than blocks, and they're a lot harder to be multi-purpose.

vM vs BTW seems silly - BTW is not that much different. Instead of having redstone, it has axles. What BTW has really done here, is added outputs. Mechanical power could very easily be replaced by redstone, and be functionally the same. BTW's big thing is thematic - we made all the bits, not just found the magic rocks. We have giant windmills and watermills, not lightbulbs. We have huge contraptions running through rooms, making it next to impossible to see anything, rather than complicated lines on the floor we can walk over. Both have multi and single block systems, it's just that BTW has done them better. Should this continue? Obviously; BTW has added pure fun. Does it fight vM? No, and that's the best part - it works with vM, extending it if you will.

This in mind, why can we not have both multi-block AND occupied systems? Both make sense, both are present(in this case, BTW actually lacks the occupant method. It's clear we can move blocks which are attached to another block. Why can't we make a boat that's a power source attached to a wood frame, upon which you place chests? I mean, minecarts are single occupants, but add in powered carts and rails, it becomes multi-block. They're already here as combinations, why separate them?

It's difficult to justify new transportation means, as far as Steve stands(Assuming wood age), because he doesn't really have a lot of technological options - the best he can really do right now is better boats, or wooden slides. Anything else require mobile power sources, or non-wood technology. Anything we come up with has to either pretty much be stationary, mechanical and at best, use cumbersomely fashioned iron - detailed, precision work is currently outside of our tech sphere.

[Triskelli]

Wow that's a lot of ideas, Haniale!

I think a major stumbling block in how transportation in Minecraft is handled is the disconnect between Powered Rails and Powered Minecarts. I prefer powered minecarts for the simplicity and aesthetic pleasure of seeing a little train chuffing across the landscape. The issue is that they are slow, weak, and cumbersome when compared to the alternative of powered rails. The problem being that powered rails require a signicant resource investment, above-average knowledge of redstone, and overwrite any usefulness Powered Minecarts might have had.

But as far as new forms of transportation, a Balloon or Airship might be a good next step, in order to speed exploration and to exploit the new Skylands and Ravines.

[morvelaira]

But as far as new forms of transportation, a Balloon or Airship might be a good next step, in order to speed exploration and to exploit the new Skylands and Ravines.

I'm not sure what form it might take, but flight seems to be a good next step. Maps as they exist in game give a general overview of the land, but they don't show buildings and there's nothing like actually seeing the landscape from every available angle to plan a grand project out.

[SterlingRed]

I agree that the powered minecart is useless. I've personally never used one since I figured out how to use the glitch boosters and now powered rails. I would like to see some changes in vM that would make the powered minecart more useful than it is now. Perhaps it having a constant momentum regardless of uphill or downhill and capable of pulling other minecarts linked to it. Although we can send multiple carts down a rail and pretty much do the same thing, it would have an early tech usage. Like say you don't have the gold or redstone necessary for powered rails. So instead you can just lay down a normal railway from say main base to an alpha base. While at alpha base you do some mining etc, and toss together a powered minecart + storage carts of your new goodies and send it on its way to main base without having to build a powered rail system and an automated minecart depo. Obviously an automated station in the long run is better, but a short term early stage solution especially for the players not familiar with redstone would be great.

Other than the above, horizontal transportation of both items and players is fine. I don't really think much else needs to be done. The nether can be used as way points or portals to other locations and minecart systems provide great transportation horizontally.

Vertical transportation of items can be done with mine carts easily and realistically. Same for the player. How do you move vertically in the real world? Stairs and elevators. We have both in minecraft. However, steve is a little more adventurous that most of us are irl and btw provides the anchor and rope as a great way to get down after steve brilliantly gets himself stuck on his roof. During exploration, especially with ravines coming in 1.8, we need a more elegant way to climb vertically without the ridiculous looking dirt towers. I'd love to see btw implement a grappling gun capable of shooting an anchor & rope further along in the tech tree. It'd be great.

I think a balloon for scenic air travel would be pretty practical. I can even see full blown zeplins and planes down the tech tree being possible. For the time being though, a hot air balloon currently fits with Steve's tech ability. We can weave reeds (basket). We can make fabric (hemp). And we have a controllable heat source (hibachi).

[Quesoman]

Personally, the only method of transportation I miss in the vM, and in BTW, that requires no technological development (we are born with it!) is running. Not for long, not too fast, but we humans have been running around the globe, whether it be for hunting, sports (god forbid!) or simply prancing around since we came to this world, and I believe it is not out of our technological reach.

As it has been said before, we have terrestrial transportation, teleportation to a certain extent, a way to travel the seas, but we lack some sort of aerial transportation, an addon to the swimming mechanics, (be able to swim rather than float) but most importantly the ability to run. (Or a bicicle) Everything is closer when you can run.

[FlowerChild]

Personally, the only method of transportation I miss in the vM, and in BTW, that requires no technological development (we are born with it!) is running. Not for long, not too fast, but we humans have been running around the globe, whether it be for hunting, sports (god forbid!) or simply prancing around since we came to this world, and I believe it is not out of our technological reach.

As it has been said before, we have terrestrial transportation, teleportation to a certain extent, a way to travel the seas, but we lack some sort of aerial transportation, an addon to the swimming mechanics, (be able to swim rather than float) but most importantly the ability to run. (Or a bicicle) Everything is closer when you can run.

IMO, this is just a matter of perspective. Given the speed involved, you could easily say that Steve is always running, and when you sneak, you're walking.

[sargunv]

-running-

We will get running in 1.8.

[Haniale]

But as far as new forms of transportation, a Balloon or Airship might be a good next step, in order to speed exploration and to exploit the new Skylands and Ravines.

I'm not sure what form it might take, but flight seems to be a good next step. Maps as they exist in game give a general overview of the land, but they don't show buildings and there's nothing like actually seeing the landscape from every available angle to plan a grand project out.

I need to disagree - Flight(compared to floating, or falling with style) is a horrible next step, especially controlled flight. Aerial transport is a good one, but flight? Back at the vM -> Buildcraft hurdle I feel. Do I want it in? Oh yes, nothing would make me happier than dropping lava on townsfolk. However, there are so many logical and, imo, fun, steps between no flight and flight we can't just skip! Hang gliders, non-controlled balloons, kites, tying many chickens together and pretending we're Link!

Flight is like the saw - a goal, not a start. I can see non-controlled hot air balloon in a steam age, though, should it happen at some point.

[morvelaira]

But as far as new forms of transportation, a Balloon or Airship might be a good next step, in order to speed exploration and to exploit the new Skylands and Ravines.

I'm not sure what form it might take, but flight seems to be a good next step. Maps as they exist in game give a general overview of the land, but they don't show buildings and there's nothing like actually seeing the landscape from every available angle to plan a grand project out.

I need to disagree - Flight(compared to floating, or falling with style) is a horrible next step, especially controlled flight. Aerial transport is a good one, but flight? Back at the vM -> Buildcraft hurdle I feel. Do I want it in? Oh yes, nothing would make me happier than dropping lava on townsfolk. However, there are so many logical and, imo, fun, steps between no flight and flight we can't just skip! Hang gliders, non-controlled balloons, kites, tying many chickens together and pretending we're Link!

Flight is like the saw - a goal, not a start. I can see non-controlled hot air balloon in a steam age, though, should it happen at some point.

I see your point. However I meant flight in a general sense of moving about not connected to the ground. I meant it to encompass all the things you mentioned here. :)

[Triskelli]

Hmm...

Quick poll, Powered Rails or Powered Minecarts? I'd prefer minecarts if they actually worked as advertised. =]

[SterlingRed]

Hmm...

Quick poll, Powered Rails or Powered Minecarts? I'd prefer minecarts if they actually worked as advertised. =]

Powered rails since powered minecarts don't really work and rails are easier to control and toggle on/off.

[Triskelli]

I suppose that derailed the topic slightly (heh).

Another focus of transportation is traveling by animals. I suppose we technically have Pigs we can ride, but it's more a joke on Notch's part. Are Horses, Turtles, etc. a valid contribution to the game, or are they fluff?

To me, Horses or something that we can ride for a significant speedboost across open terrain would be a Godsend, encouraging exploration on land and perhaps acting as a mobile base...

[Quesoman]

-horses-

However, other large mods, such as mo'creatures, already implements this quite nicely. If Notch adds this great, but I believe reproducing what others have already done is a waste of FC's time.

To be honest, they are quite fun to play around with in the MC mod.I suggest it to anyone interested. Certainly, they are not fluff whatsoever.

[magikeh]

i do agree that the flying part of things is a bit too far ahead in VM and BTW, and i also agree that mounts should have been a part of VM since... 1.3? But now we are in the mechanical age and i think that there should be a vehicle of some sorts (and so many ppl are pointing to the 1880's) i think the bicycle would be a great addition to BTW, it promotes functionality, speed, efficiency, and the user must wait a while to develop the tools and parts needed to make and use the bike (like gears, belts, wheels...etc) so the user will not have the bike right off the hop!! Also i strongly support the use of 'controlled falling' or 'gliding' rather than flying

[BoredomAddict]

I think a balloon for scenic air travel would be pretty practical. I can even see full blown zeplins and planes down the tech tree being possible. For the time being though, a hot air balloon currently fits with Steve's tech ability. We can weave reeds (basket). We can make fabric (hemp). And we have a controllable heat source (hibachi).

I agree with this idea, although there would have to be a way to power the hibachi, maybe putting coal into it like the powered minecart. Also, parachutes/hang gliders would be a good way to go, especially with the ravines coming in 1.8.

[Brothulhu]

i do agree that the flying part of things is a bit too far ahead in VM and BTW, and i also agree that mounts should have been a part of VM since... 1.3? But now we are in the mechanical age and i think that there should be a vehicle of some sorts (and so many ppl are pointing to the 1880's) i think the bicycle would be a great addition to BTW, it promotes functionality, speed, efficiency, and the user must wait a while to develop the tools and parts needed to make and use the bike (like gears, belts, wheels...etc) so the user will not have the bike right off the hop!! Also i strongly support the use of 'controlled falling' or 'gliding' rather than flying

I don't know if a true vehicle fits in with vM or BTW to be honest. Mainly because... have you ever ridden a bike on dirt or uphill? it sucks man. Especial dirt uphill.

The worst.

As for the controlled falling/gliding, I think (and yes, i have suggested this on the suggestions thread) a parachute would fit in semi well. For reasons that can be seen elsewhere.

[KriiEiter]

I think the logical next step would be horizontal platform movement. This would allow for somewhat "aerial" transportation. I see it like some sort of rail block that gets a motor of some sort attached to it. Once you have your motor attached to your rails you then suspend a platform from that, and voila! horizontal movement that doesn't require traversing hills. I guess if you wanted to compare it to something, it would be like a horizontal skii lift.

I suppose you could really substitute in rope and have two pulleys at each end of the line with a platform hanging from that. Either way, I think that some form of that would be the next step we need before any form of flying device.

[Fracture]

Wow, lots of good ideas. Don't really have much to add at the moment, as I'm dead tired, but I'll try.

@KriiEiter: Makes sense as a next step. It would be like bringing our current elevator tech to a horizontal plane. Steve's not really having to make anything new, just re-purpose what he already has. It'd also make for pretty cool systems if we could pull off elevators that move both up/down and side to side.

@Brothulu: Mountain bikes, man. They're the bomb for hill-riding.

@BoredomAddict Parachutes wouldn't be quite as good for ravines, I think. Imagine trying to parachute down a narrow gulley, and a stray gust hits you. Craggy walls are killer when applied brutally to the body.

@Triskelli I'm guessing, when you say mobile base, that you mean the horses could double as pack mules, so you could bring the essentials of a workshop with you when you explore?

@Haniale: I agree completely. From both natural progression and fun perspectives, Steve needs to fall before he can fly. Trying to make do with the perpetual north-ward wind current would make for some interesting layouts when attempting balloon travel, not to mention the chaotic flight patterns of a group of chickens. I disagree on flight being just a goal though-- in a way it's both a goal AND a start. Our goal would be flight that we could, to some degree, control-- such as hot-air balloons. It would allow us natural transportation to higher places, etc. Thereafter, it would become the start of a new generation of transportation. Flight would lead into aerial vehicles designed for different things-- perhaps zeplins, or even airborne platforms.

On a related note, I love the idea of tacking parachutes to things. Now I want to make a system which dumps items into a storage minecart, ties it to a parachute, then blows it up a shaft with steam.

[Haniale]

Since we seem to be shifting into flight as a heavy consideration, some definitions might be useful, so we can categorise different types of flight:

Falling: Start at top, end at bottom. Rate of descent variable. Parachute, bungie cord, etc. Very little control over direction.
Flung: Launched from a device, but otherwise Falling and unpowered. Much forward momentum, making accuracy difficult. Fired from cannon, windmill powered slingshot, back of exploding cow.
Floating: Capable of maintaining altitude, variable hight, uncontrolled direction. Steering is done by winds. Hot air ballons, kites, steam vent use.
Flight: Floating, with control over steering. Possibly self-powered. Hang-gliders, planes, airships, etc.


I don't know if these are technically accurate, but they seem to be the social terminology.

I question the fun of piloted flight vehicles, such as planes, for one reason: The SPC command "fly" is about as fun as wolf rinds. Useful? Sure, but not fun. Powered flight might be better left for flying structures than flying minecarts, if that makes sense.
@Fracture:
I think in regardes to realism in things like parachute in canyons with cross drafts and walls, the fun is worth the loss of realism. The occasional draft would be okay, but air currents caused by being too near the wall would make a fun thing unfun, in my eyes. I mean, we walk clean through lava on a regular basis, rarely eat and never drink. Think we can get away with ignoring a few "real" things.

Also, Flight Age? I don't know - on one hand, it's awesome, but on the other maybe it's a little small of a concept to really work for an advancement stage(Kind of like how diamond is a goal, but also the start of nether work). The discovery of flight could be an age, I suppose, but the tools made with it would really be more like the hopper than the saw - useful, almost required, but not a base tech. Although, with all the new worlds coming into play I wonder if multiple worlds could be accessed from one, via a portal system. If so.. space race? Hmmm. I do see what you mean though, but I think aerial vehicles might be a little too far - at least, manned, anyway. I can see a kite based block dispenser making life a hundred times easier when we make castles, or rope following balloon delivery devices. Air ships with x amount of flight time in them, allowing you to fill them with tnt and send them off somewhere. Where doesn't really matter, but there shall be lolling when it runs out of juice.

Flight is also a technical issue, with how chunks get loaded - given how the game is, it could be impossible for most computers to make use of it as an exploration in the traditional sense(with everything else BTW, and future updates, would be running as well), though Floating exploration might be very possible, and I don't think I need to mention how valid I think Flung based exploration is.

Also, I wonder about the flight generating properties of lava..

[cheechako]

Since we seem to be shifting into flight as a heavy consideration, some definitions might be useful, so we can categorise different types of flight:

Falling: Start at top, end at bottom. Rate of descent variable. Parachute, bungie cord, etc. Very little control over direction.
Flung: Launched from a device, but otherwise Falling and unpowered. Much forward momentum, making accuracy difficult. Fired from cannon, windmill powered slingshot, back of exploding cow.
Floating: Capable of maintaining altitude, variable hight, uncontrolled direction. Steering is done by winds. Hot air ballons, kites, steam vent use.
Flight: Floating, with control over steering. Possibly self-powered. Hang-gliders, planes, airships, etc.

Is that what you see in MC, or more general definitions. If it is the later, I don't agree in some cases.

AFAIK, some parachutes can give an expert a fair amount of directional control. Hang-gliders and gliders tend to slowly fall, but they can use air currents for lift - these can come from air rising against the side of a mountain/hill or from thermal currents. Many birds and expert pilots will circle thermals and can gain a lot of altitude with little effort.

I think the distinctions involve speed, lift, and directional control. Power to weight ratio matters too, but weight is meaningless in MC. How much does Steve weight when his pockets are full?


Re: Steam (seems more appropriate here than the suggestion thread)

I'm curious as to what people think "steam power" is? Steam can be used for heat, cooking, cleaning, etc. But steam power is really using steam to turn something and thus generating mechanical power.

Also, steam is hot... really hot. If we propose ore smelting or whatever, then it seems wrong to use it to lift items or Steve. IMHO, if steam is implemented, it should be as dangerous as lava.

[Haniale]

Is that what you see in MC, or more general definitions. If it is the later, I don't agree in some cases.

General defs, with generous allowance for game world physics, and more importantly, fun. More the "Typical" idea that comes to mind, than the detailed one. You're right about birds, gliders, chutes, etc, but I was making an attempt to reduce it to clear categories, split by mechanics than by where the form of transport would truely sit - droping a rock is falling, as is a chute, but in reality, the two couldn't be more different. Using those categories, thermal currents wouldn't shift floating into flying, it'd juts reset the floating a bit. I made basically no attempt to account for how they really work, and instead how someone first looking at them might see it.

As for steam, same thing; realism be damned, we can take lava baths and live, hot air is nothing. Have steam as a power source, to be plugged into, say, a pipe and operate as a transport system, or plugged into a cooker and it becomes a cooker. It's like electricity - it keeps the brain running, but it can also screw you up pretty fast. I do admit I like the idea of lava/steam danger(... lava steam!), so perhaps just have "heat", which can heat air and cause it to rise, or boil water and cause steam. Steam vents become a risk then - too close, boiled eggs, too far, no lift, just right, you get the force of it rising, but cooled enough to not kill you.