New Release! (BTW Version 2.70)

[PatrickSJ]

The turntable looks interesting. Right now my mind is sparking thoughts of using turntable timers to simulate gear ratios.

[FlowerChild]

Seriously dude, are you arguing that constructing a timer the size of a building, when all it is, is an extended series of NOT gates, and when it will freeze up on you every time you load a save-game is 'fun'?

Ok, my apologies for my initial reaction to this. I've been thinking it over, and I think it may represent a valid concern.

So let's open the topic up here a bit. Is anyone else thinking that the Turntable is overpowered and may be taking away some of the fun of building complex timers?

[empath]

i haven't had a chance to install it yet, since I'm at work -- can someone explain what exactly the turntable does?

I think that rather than a built in timer, you could make it move x distance for each pulse of mechanical or redstone power?

[Urian]

I wouldn't say it's overpowered, no. If you want to change something, you might perhaps decrease the number of settings since this would add a need to use several turntables along with gates to tune the timing. I can't say I really see a need to change it though, at least not before it's been playtested some more by the community :)

[Triskelli]

So let's open the topic up here a bit. Is anyone else thinking that the Turntable is overpowered and may be taking away some of the fun of building complex timers?

Wha?

NO WAI!

Seriously though, I think the turntable is a brilliant solution to a host of common problems. I'd rather have it than a massive array of diodes and torches just to have a 1-minute timer. A rather silly question, isn't it?

*EDIT*

I will agree with Urian that the "20 minutes for 90 degrees" is a bit superfluous, though. Easy enough to get a pulse every 20 minutes with the turntable set to 5 minutes a turn and a torch on one side.

[FlowerChild]

I think what I may do is rebalance the recipe actually. What I am thinking of doing is replacing the redstone wire by a gear (I don't like the axle in there right now...it made more sense before I included the switch, but now it's just inconsistent with the rest of the mechanical recipes), and replace the axle with a watch.

The increased gold demand would mean that these aren't as easy to come by as they are right now (in addition to having to setup the mechanical power to run it), the watch recipe already includes a unit of redstone dust to justify the redstone interaction with the block, and it gives an additional element of in-game logic to the precise timing element.

Also, I don't expect these to be built in sufficient number (like the BD was) to make the stack-limit on watches cause problems for people making more than one Turntable.

And yeah, I agree that the 20 minute setting is superfluous. Actually, I think the 10 minute setting is as well, since by placing torches on 2 neighboring sides of a rotating block, and setting it to the 5 minute setting, you wind up with a full day/night timer.

So yes, I think I can easily trim that down to 9 settings without causing any real loss of functionality.

[Haniale]

I don't think it's so much you've taken away something(with the timers) so much as you've highlighted a lacking in the base method. You can still do the giant house of switches, but end of the day, 99% of people who made those couldn't care less about the giant logic, they just want a damn clock. Same reason people use integrated redstone - we don't care about making awkward not-gates, when we want to make awkward mega-structures. You can make counters from redstone, but that doesn't make a counterblock anti-fun. It might be a little op in how many blocks above it in can turn but that's a non-issue anyway so..

Loose the extra settings - I'm trying to justify keeping the extras, and the best I can do is an awkwardly timed week setting.

[Zhil]

I love the idea above of using em like gearboxes. Now to find a use for that :)

[FlowerChild]

I love the idea above of using em like gearboxes. Now to find a use for that :)

You can use them as Gear Boxes? That's new to me :)

[Zhil]

Well, more like differentials I guess. Wrong word usage

I just realized that these allow for vertical redstone too, something to use until lenses come around :)

[Battosay]

I had the same thought : "20min, woaw that's a lot".
5min sounds better, and the clock makes sense, so I say go for it ^^

[FlowerChild]

I had the same thought : "20min, woaw that's a lot".
5min sounds better, and the clock makes sense, so I say go for it ^^

Yeah, I think so too. I've already reduced the number of settings to 9, and while integrating the clock into the recipe, realized that clocks are actually stackable (man...there's just no rhyme nor reason to what is stackable and what is not in vMC), so it doesn't even have the slight problem there that I anticipated ;)

As I mentioned last night I was pretty damned tired when I finally completed the Turntable and released it, so I think I didn't properly consider a couple of things.

It actually turned out to be a much bigger pain in the ass to get the vanilla blocks rotating than I thought. It turns out there's at least 5 completely different systems in the game for designating a block's facing (yes, this is an utterly retarded way to structure code), so I had to go through and special-case each vanilla block that I wanted to rotate.

All the mod blocks took me about 10 minutes total to rotate (because I have a standard system to indicate facing). The vanilla blocks on the other hand took quite a few hours to go through one by one. That's why I was also able to put out that video a full day before the feature was actually ready to release.

Anyways, by the end of it I was so sick of dealing with that nonsense that I just wanted to get it out the door, and was in a state of mind where I probably would have been ready to beat Notch to death with an Object Oriented Programming book had he been within reach ;)

[KriiEiter]

I was actually thinking that they were much too easy to make. Adding another use for gold makes me super happy as well. I always have no use for gold. But I think you should add moulding into the recipe so that it requires a saw to make (putting it higher on the tech tree then).

Not sure where the moulding would fit in though.

[Zhil]

After playing around, I kinda miss a faster time. I'd love to able to make one button press do a 180° turn without having to play around with delays. Not that it's hard to create, it's just a shame I have to start using repeaters and gates just to make a turntable that has two states (very handy).

[Battosay]

But I think you should add moulding into the recipe so that it requires a saw to make (putting it higher on the tech tree then).

Not sure where the moulding would fit in though.

Good idea. Maybe pannels and not moulding, and use them instead of planks ?

[FlowerChild]

Good idea. Maybe pannels and not moulding, and use them instead of planks ?

Yup, good idea. I'll make that change in a couple of minutes. It makes sense given that you'd expect a certain amount of precision crafting to go into the Turntable.

You guys might want to take a look at the OP on the Minecraft forum thread for the mod too, as I've updated it with descriptions of the new items added with the latest release.

I'll probably be putting out a small version shortly to address a few overall balancing issues with the mod. Not sure if they'll all be popular (especially without you guys knowing what's going to be in the release after that), but I believe they're necessary to properly balance a few things, and you'll just have to trust me that they'll all make sense in a version or two ;)

[Savageperson]

What about belts? It does spin, as saws do, and they don't have many uses. As for the max time, there's no reason to get rid of 20 min right? It doesn't hurt. Just my opinion though.

[FlowerChild]

What about belts? It does spin, as saws do, and they son't have many uses. As for the max time, those no reason to get rid of 20 min right? It doesn't hurt. Just my opinion though.

Tanned leather has plenty of *intended* uses in the mod man. You have to keep in mind that the mod is a work in progress and many of the items don't have their final use included.

Also, I included the belt in the saw recipe because it accepts input from any direction and you'd expect it to need to be able to turn the blade at high-speed. It also interfaces wood and metal in a way that other mechanical blocks do not.

I tend to think of the Turntable as being more akin to the Mill Stone in the way it functions, and with the changes I've already made to the recipe, I'm happy with how it fits into the tech-tree.

I'm removing the extra settings from the Turntable because they're extraneous, and it DOES hurt in that it makes the device more complicated than it needs to be. 11 settings is a lot to keep track of, even with the gradations I have marked on the block. 9 is still pretty heavy, but it's better.

[Zhil]

Found another new use. One block with two rs-torches on top of the turntable make it act like a T flip flop. A very very compact T flop flop :)

[FlowerChild]

Found another new use. One block with two rs-torches on top of the turntable make it act like a T flip flop. A very very compact T flop flop :)

You mean if you rig an input to rotate the Turntable a single increment when powered?

If that's the case, then yeah, you're absolutely right. Sweet :)

[Zhil]

Yeah, and a button has the correct delay out of the box, so a button can simply toggle the memory cell without extra redstone.

[BinoAl]

WOOO!!!! lol. awesome job, cant wait to play with the turntable :D

[finite8]

It turns out there's at least 5 completely different systems in the game for designating a block's facing (yes, this is an utterly retarded way to structure code), so I had to go through and special-case each vanilla block that I wanted to rotate.

I thought that would be a problem when it came to dealing with the rotation / direction of a block. I assume then that facing down has a value of 0? (due to the default placement direction of the BD)

Good work all the same. I see the Turntable block being used in more advanced designs later on. Once we can attach them to platforms in the side, then attach wheels to them I am SO gonna make myself a sweet hotrod. Ooo... Maybe with a Waterwheel and floating platforms...

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[BigShinyToys]

the turn table is Balanced. Cos the simplest clock is Made on only 3 torches 4 pieces of wire and three Dirt Blocks . I have already started work on a Clock and it uses this Device to its MAX. I have found it very for making Timers And counters . I do agree that 20 minutes is to long Maby making it Have a 5 min max is good . but please don't change the recipe. It is simple And it functions simply . think of how complex a device like the Block dispenser Should be ( e.g. there should be a Chest And a Piston in the block dispenser recipe . to represent the making then pushing out a block function then a Diamond saw so it can break a block . but the recipe is Simple. Only one rare Item ( and might i say it is not that rare in half my worlds i find one mobspanner by accident in the first hour of play. ) Please Don't change the recipe Please . ( and if you have to change it this is how i would have it )

[gear][Wood][gear]
[stone][gearbox][stone]
[gear][gearbox][gear]

the gears represent the different speeds the Gear boxes Engage and disengage them to chance speed

this recipe makes it harder to get but douse Not require NON renewable resources . ( if you add Gold then it will be out of sink with the other recipes ) ( making it out of stuff you have to farm like wood or hemp means it would reward the player for having farms that work well ) and the reward is a Stable time source.


I know i kinda missed the debate here ( sorry im in Australia +08:00 GMT) But please conciser making it More costly but Not ( rare minerals Dependent ) please Please.

Big Shiny Toys

[FlowerChild]

Thanks for reminding me why I don't like to discuss feature implementation before I release Shiny :)