Glox wrote:CreeperCommando wrote:Well, I wouldn't call the universe a perpetuum mobile cause of many reason, mainly due to the whole definition is based on the ability to draw out more energy than put in from a machine.
Also note that the universe is not in thermodynamical equillibrium or time independent, breaking both definition 3 and 4 by my above post
wiki:
A perpetual motion machine of the first kind produces work without the input of energy. It thus violates the first law of thermodynamics: the law of conservation of energy. = runs forever and creates energy out of nowhere
A perpetual motion machine of the second kind is a machine which spontaneously converts thermal energy into mechanical work. When the thermal energy is equivalent to the work done, this does not violate the law of conservation of energy. = runs forever without creating or losing energy.
It is well known that the amount of energy in the universe is constant, and since the universe is constantly changing, the universe does fall in the second category.
Uhm, your citation firmly claims that "A perpetual motion machine of the second kind is a machine which
spontaneously converts thermal energy into mechanical work". Which I'll assume is the layman terms of reducing entropy which thus firmly means that the universe is NOT a perpetual motion machine of 'second kind'.
Also to note, most scientists believe that the universe will suffer a fatal fate in the form of either 'the cold death' or the 'big rip', not what I'd call indefinite timescales.
Another thing to add, you're playing a dangerous ballgame in claiming that the universe, being infinite in size has a 'constant' amount of energy. I understand what you're getting at, but that's definition of energies on a whole other level....
Entropy is a measure of chaos, used in physics and chemistry. Second law of thermodynamics claims that all kinds of time dependent processes in any kind of closed system, the universe included mind you, always create a positive gain of entropy for said system, thus that said system will only get more chaotic --> less and less usable energy.